195: Short Hair, Long Hair: Why Gender Rules and Norms Don’t Make Sense

Rosie (00:12)
I need your help on something because as you know, I have very short hair. I shaved it all off at the beginning of the year and I've recently started teaching. And a question I am asked a lot by the kids.

Are you a boy or a girl? And then I say I'm a girl. Why do you have short hair? Girls don't have short hair. And then there's this conversation around how girls can have short hair.

And I try to never get defensive. It's a genuine question, right? Are you a boy or a girl? So they know, they're like, huh, they must be like, she kind of looks like a girl, but then she's got short hair, so she must be a boy. Like, what's going on in their heads must be absolute chaos. And I want a good answer to give them without giving a lecture. Often I say, girls can have short hair. No, they can't. And then I point out teachers at the school.

female teachers who have short hair. They're like, aw. And they sort of look at me like, yeah. And then I said, and some boys have long hair, don't they? And then they pause and go, yeah. And I said, you could have short hair if you wanted to, it doesn't matter. And then the conversation just sort of stops. But I'm wondering, is there a better answer I could give? I don't know how to answer the question or the statement, girls can't have short hair.

Roula (01:38)
Like so many of our topics, they're so ad hoc and while you're talking, I had two thoughts on my mind which do not answer your question but could be the conditioning of why girls have short hair, long hair. Okay, I have not met a parent, not myself, not even myself. When our daughters were little, we took them to the hairdresser and we said, let's have a short hair. It's kind of...

Rosie (01:43)
Yeah

Okay.

Totally, yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-mm.

Roula (02:09)
praise that they have long hair, beauty, I don't know what it is, health? Healthy? I don't know what it is, I don't know. As a mom of two girls, it did not cross my mind for a second when they were little to cut their hair short. This is one. I'll come back to it. Second, have you seen any children program

Rosie (02:17)
Mmm.

Roula (02:37)
whether it's animation or a movie, all girls have long

hair.

Rosie (02:44)
This is just, my god. And you know what, when females do have short, like buzz cut hair, it's usually because they're in a mental asylum or like, have you seen Stranger Things? Yeah, G.I. Jane, like something really unusual or the character Eleven in Stranger Things, she has a shaved head. So she's a bit of a mutant, yeah.

Roula (02:54)
G-I-Jane

See? Yeah. So they shaved her head. Exactly.

Or if it's an alien movie or extraterrestrial, it could be.

Rosie (03:12)
Yeah, why do we perpetuate

this? I think it's so ridiculous. It's like, you know how, well, I'm assuming it's the same over there, but blue is a boy's color and pink is a girl's color. That's this thing. And it always pisses me off. we did, yes, we did. Yes, I will definitely link that below. I don't have the episode number. But I think...

Roula (03:17)
Sit.

And we made an episode about it, remember? In the beginning of our 5-6 episodes.

Rosie (03:37)
Even though that stereotype still rings true, especially with new parents and they know the sex of their child before they give birth and they'll go out and buy all the clothes in the boys' colours or the girls' colours. Shits me. But if I wear a blue t-shirt, the kids don't ask me are you a boy or a girl. Or if they see a male teacher wearing a pink shirt, they don't go, you a boy or a girl? So that stereotype's been broken down. So why?

Why is this hair still a thing?

Roula (04:09)
In lot of cultures, if boys have long hair, okay, well, culture, Lebanon. Boys with long hair were associated with boys listening to rock music. Rock is the devil music, and it means they are bad, they could put them in jail or whatever.

Rosie (04:31)
Whoa.

Roula (04:34)
So boys also had it very difficult to have long hair. At school, if boys have long hair, they tell them, you look like a girl, et cetera. It brings us back, Rosie, to beliefs, religion, and societal rules and regulations. It has nothing to do with who we are. It makes us who we are. And this is, think, what you and I are bothered by it.

Rosie (04:38)
Mmm.

This is true, yeah.

Hmm.

It makes us who we

are. Yes, it makes us who we are. Holy shit. Yes, that does bother me. Okay.

Roula (05:06)
I had short hair in my teenage years,

preteen and teen, very short hair, shaved on the sides. And you know what? They gave me the name Roland, a boy's name. Everyone saw me as a boy. Not one boy wanted to have a romantic relationship with me because I had short hair.

And we also talked about this. had short hair because I wanted to associate my freedom with the boys and not be treated as a girl with restrictions. It has so much to do with this topic. But let's go back to school, to the children. Okay? I think that I don't have a right answer, you know, It's just how I think. The best answer...

Rosie (05:38)
Mmm.

Yeah, yeah.

Roula (05:57)
To repeat for these children on and on is not whether short hair for boys, long hair with girls. The right answer is you do whatever makes you happy.

Rosie (06:04)
Mm-mm.

Yeah, see that was an answer I started saying. Why do you have short hair? I said, cause I like it. It's nice and cool. And that also makes them stop and go, ⁓ it's like you were saying in our episode about taking surnames, you didn't know you had a choice. So I don't think these kids know they have a choice. Whoa. Holy shit. Yeah.

Roula (06:29)
Hmm

I agree 100%.

How it would look like if...

Rosie (06:40)
Wow.

Roula (06:45)
That would be really crazy. Ask some girls and some boys to raise your Who of them is curious to know how it feels to have short hair? And for the boys, who's curious to know how it feels to have long hair? And you know what I would do? I would go on this, I'm not going to call the website this cheap website, which we probably should not be ordering from it. my God, I hate this.

Rosie (06:50)
Mm.

Mmm.

Roula (07:15)
and get a couple of short hair wigs and a couple of long hair wigs.

Rosie (07:19)
That'd be

fun, yes!

Roula (07:22)
and have them play a game by just to feel, to have a mirror and have the kids, whoever feels want to try, to try it. And then you can put ground rules that we're not here to laugh at each other or to point fingers. We're here to just, you know, I have short hair talking about yourself. Would you like to know how it feels? Or would you like to know how it feels to have long hair like you're, like Jessica sitting next to you for the boy?

Rosie (07:25)
Yeah.

Mm. Mm.

Mm.

Roula (07:51)
I think that would be a cool experiment.

Rosie (07:52)
That's a cool idea.

Lead with curiosity. I love it. I wonder what parents' reactions would be to that. That scares me.

Roula (08:03)
⁓ I didn't think of that.

Rosie (08:06)
There's just so many layers, aren't there? But yes, this conversation, well, why not? I'm not harming them, but I think some parents would have some opinions around that when their kid comes home and talks about it.

Roula (08:09)
Are you allowed to do something like this?

Maybe do it on your last day at school.

Rosie (08:24)
Yeah, and

then I can just run off into the sunset. No consequences.

Roula (08:27)
Yes.

I love this conversation. Liam doesn't want to cut his hair. And so far we keep telling him we have to cut it just to give it some shape. And now I'm thinking, well, let him grow his hair. And I'm thinking this after our conversation. It's not like I was thinking about it an hour ago. No, I'm like, let him grow his hair if this is he wants.

Rosie (08:33)
Mmm.

Right, yep.

Why? Yeah.

Yeah.

No.

Yeah,

yeah. Whoa. Cool. Yeah. This was a good conversation because you've helped me go frame it. Like they don't know they have a choice and let's just have fun with it. Who wants to know what it would feel like? Let's put on the wig. Why not? It is a choice. Yeah. It does sound cool. I want to know what it feels like to have long hair again. I'm just going to get myself a wig.

Roula (09:01)
Cool.

Yeah, my God, that sounds so cool.

Yeah, so cool. I mean, listeners, this topic is important. Let us know. Have you ever had short hair as a woman and have you ever had long hair as a guy? What's your opinion on the topic?

Rosie (09:33)
Mmm.

Yeah. Okay.

Roula (09:37)
Thank you so

much for listening. Bye!

Rosie (09:41)
Mm-hmm