61: The Lost Art Of Flirting and Why We Must To Get It Back

Roula (00:00.597)

You have a lot to say about it. I love it. Rosie. Rosie, I have something for you. Something super fun. Well, it's fun. Are we talking at the same time?

Rosie (00:04.275)

Roula yes. yes ruler. you've got a very cheeky look on your face.

Rosie (00:15.276)

Yeah, can you shut up? No, you go, you go.

Roula (00:20.917)

I have something fun to ask you about because with the tumultuous time we're having with gender, with patriarchy, with women and men and all this battle and the hashtag me too and everything. No one, like how do we know if someone is flirting with us?

Rosie (00:28.791)

Hmm.

Roula (00:42.655)

Like, do we want people to flirt with us? Can we talk about flirting? I miss flirting so much. know, I'm Gen X Flirting was like everywhere.

Rosie (00:46.478)

Hmm.

you

Rosie (00:54.477)

So you think people don't flirt anymore?

Roula (00:57.243)

No! I think people don't flirt anymore. What do you think?

Rosie (00:58.957)

Really? I don't know. I don't get out enough. I have no idea.

Roula (01:06.645)

Do you remember how flirting looked like in the past?

Rosie (01:10.675)

Well, no, this is my issue. Half the time I don't even realize when somebody is flirting with me.

Rosie (01:19.469)

And it's after the fact, someone will say, Rosie, they were flirting with you. I'm like, what? No, they weren't.

Roula (01:19.667)

Roula (01:28.341)

Okay, so what's flirting?

Rosie (01:31.757)

Hmm.

Roula (01:33.777)

Let's redefine it because I think my kids don't know what flirting is. The millennials and Gen Z Xi, they don't know what flirting is because you grew up in a really harsh world. And I'm not saying that we Gen X did not grow up in a harsh, harsh world. But when I was growing up walking down the street and someone whistling, that was flirting and I've never felt offended.

Rosie (01:39.114)

Yeah.

Rosie (01:59.317)

Eww! Eww! No! Okay. Yeah, to me that's eww. No.

Roula (02:04.013)

Do I go and talk to this person? No. If this person wants to approach me, do I want to talk to this person? No. It's like hard no.

Rosie (02:13.087)

Mm-hmm.

Roula (02:15.633)

And so let me put it this way. Maybe GenX will relate to this because saying it, can sound so wrong. If someone nice and cool has whistled, that would be flirting. If someone ugly and I don't like it and it's not my type of person whistled, that's harassment. Back then, we didn't know anything else. This is how it was.

Rosie (02:22.956)

Mm.

Rosie (02:38.633)

Mm-hmm. Mm. Okay. Okay.

Hmm. Flirting is so contentious because I think it's very much considered to be sexual. But I don't necessarily think it is. I have come to realize. I think that can be perfectly platonic to flirt. Don't you?

Roula (03:00.297)

You're right.

Roula (03:11.797)

Absolutely, absolutely. I mean, I would like to disagree. So we make this episode more exciting. But flirting, you know, you can flirt with a cashier. So when you do your OK, this is something I do often. I flirt with the intention to put a smile on their face. And I have this flirty character. I like it. So when I.

Rosie (03:12.747)

Yeah!

Rosie (03:25.036)

Give me an example.

Rosie (03:33.899)

Okay, okay.

You do, yeah.

Roula (03:40.789)

So I bought something and I'm a t the cashier and she's doing something that I think it's funny. I share it with her and I thought, Oh, look what you did. That was so funny. It made me laugh or I love your hair. How? Oh yeah. I was at the lingerie shop actually. And this lady, she had beautiful hair style like year 40 and she was beautiful. I read it in 1940s. Yes.

Rosie (03:52.543)

Mmm.

Rosie (04:04.448)

Hang on, so like the 1940s, is that what you mean? Year four, okay, gotcha, yeah, yeah,

Roula (04:11.141)

and the lady working there, that woman was so beautiful. I really enjoyed talking to her because it's so nice to talk to nice people. Sorry, guys. I know I might sound so Gen X, but that's the reality.

Rosie (04:14.877)

huh.

Mm.

Rosie (04:25.451)

You just being honest, I...

Roula (04:26.953)

Yeah, and talking to her about her hair, I wasn't just complimenting her. I was telling her how good she looks and how I find it really wonderful that she take the time to do her hair like this with a smile. And that was I'm flirting with her. Do I want to ask her out? No. But this this nice conversation light. Make people feel good. It's also flirting.

Rosie (04:41.824)

Mm.

Rosie (04:49.162)

Mmm.

Rosie (04:53.899)

This is true. You know, I, I'm scared to give people a compliment, especially a stranger, because I think, my God, they're going to think I'm being inappropriate. But there's so many times I think, wow, they look great. Or, you smell nice. Like someone might smell nice. You know, when a perfume just is amazing. but I'm looking down because I, I, was messaging a friend the other day about flirting.

Roula (05:11.317)

Yeah! I love it!

Rosie (05:21.704)

And you know why this is your fault, Rula. There was a podcast episode of mine that you listened to and you accused me of being very flirty on it. And I was offended. Not, not truly, but I was like, I am not. And then I thought, well, actually what's wrong with that? And I was talking to this friend. He recently binged listen to all my podcasts. Cause I, you know, he's a relatively new friend. He said, well, I wouldn't call it flirting.

I'd say it was mutual understanding and enjoyment. And I said, well, see, that makes more sense. And he goes, yeah, but flirting is the same thing as that. And I went,

So he called it mutual understanding and enjoyment. That's his definition of flirting

Roula (06:05.973)

Okay, in a world where we're really scared of being judged for flirting, we would use these kind of words to make other people feel comfortable.

Rosie (06:13.692)

Mm-hmm Bit long-winded, Yeah, but that's all it is right? It's just this

Roula (06:21.491)

If we want to stop dating online, listen to me. If we want, so listen to me.

Rosie (06:27.05)

Shut up Rosie! Yes I'm listening, I'm listening.

Roula (06:29.781)

See, I don't tell you shut up, I ask you to listen to me.

If we want to stop the dating online, then we have to flirt more. And I don't mean flirt by touching someone's boob or I don't know. can't. mean, isn't it crazy how I have an example or how inappropriate flirts with a woman is, but I don't know what's an inappropriate flirt with a man is.

Rosie (06:45.043)

Yeah.

Rosie (06:54.995)

Yeah. Ooh.

Roula (06:58.099)

Because I wouldn't walk and touch someone's penis. But people would like touch the boobs as a flirty way.

Rosie (07:01.042)

Well no.

Rosie (07:05.979)

Yeah. What the fuck? Well, do you think that's acceptable? Like, no. Okay. Cool. Just checking. Just checking. Okay. So what, let's teach our listeners. What, what do you think is an appropriate way to flirt? Give us some examples. So you gave us an example of the lady with the 1940s hair and she looks stunning and you know, you're complimenting her or at the checkout, you're, you know, sharing something funny with them. What else?

Roula (07:09.981)

No! No, I don't think that's acceptable. No, no.

Roula (07:25.426)

Yeah!

Yeah.

Roula (07:32.659)

Yeah, I don't think that flirting is standing there and laughing and being like, a fool out of yourself. No, it's also being sincere. Flirting is looking at someone and have your eyes smiling at them. Not your face, like you're seeing that person. And no, don't think whistling is flirting. I got it wrong back then.

Rosie (07:47.017)

Hmm.

Rosie (08:00.977)

No, I think that's vulgar.

Roula (08:01.225)

But being kind and if you like someone and as you said, it doesn't have to be sexual and not everyone you flirt with you want to ask out on a date. But making someone's day by being playful and sincere is awesome.

Rosie (08:09.863)

Hmm.

Rosie (08:20.623)

It's being playful, isn't it? Yes, sincere. Yeah, it is. is. It is. I think there's so many blurred lines though, because it's a bit hard to define.

Roula (08:33.589)

I know someone on LinkedIn. I never met that person in person. I like her very much because we have things in common. He started being a podcaster. He always wears a snapback hat. And he looks so cute wearing it. When he doesn't, I'm like, that's a totally different person. And telling that to the person, for example, is kind of flirting. It's like...

Rosie (08:36.25)

Okay.

Rosie (08:52.051)

Mm-hmm.

Rosie (08:56.276)

Mm-mm.

Rosie (09:01.0)

Mm.

Roula (09:03.092)

you look so nice with a snapback. I almost did not recognize you when you took it off. It's the way we talk is flirting.

Rosie (09:09.257)

It sounds like we're just being honest and playful. That's what it's sounding like when we're giving these examples. It's just being open, a little bit vulnerable because you're putting yourself on the line, sharing how you really feel. Even if it's just something little like the snapback hat.

Roula (09:15.665)

Yeah.

Roula (09:27.997)

and joyful. It must be light and joyful and sincere.

Rosie (09:29.222)

Joyful, yes.

light and joyful. So is it different when it is romantic or sexual? So for example

Rosie (09:42.771)

Well, you can't make you have this example. I don't know. When you were single, you're out and there's a man or someone you like and you're flirting with them because maybe you would like to go out with him. Maybe you would like to do something. Is the flirting going to be different?

Roula (10:02.805)

Yeah, it feels a little bit more close, like the body language is different. You might be sitting next to each other. You might be buying drinks to each other. You know, there's this naughty look in the eyes sometimes.

Rosie (10:07.24)

you

Rosie (10:20.711)

Mm.

Roula (10:21.255)

it gives signs that there is some chemistry, some physical chemistry. It's not platonic. Yeah.

Rosie (10:24.721)

Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. It's nuanced, isn't it?

Roula (10:32.732)

I think body language is so important because when you're flirting in a platonic way, your body distance is in a respectful place. Like this is your space, this is my space, and my words are doing the job. When it's in a sexual way, even if it's a one night stand or one date, I'm not saying you're building a relationship on this, guys.

Rosie (10:39.387)

Yeah, right.

Rosie (10:55.341)

Mm-mm.

Roula (10:57.671)

your body would be closer, either your shoulders are touching or the way you're sitting, it's like more close to each other. And you're talking, you're laughing. This is, is romantic flirting.

Rosie (11:05.156)

Mm.

Rosie (11:12.136)

Hmm.

Roula (11:14.047)

Maybe I should start a course, how to flirt.

Rosie (11:15.911)

That would fly off the shelves. Seriously, I think it would.

Roula (11:21.897)

When I go to parties, I miss flirting. When I see, when I don't see flirting, I'm like, this was such a dry party. And at same time, I'm careful what I say because people sometimes think, yeah, but, but we don't want to be harassed and we don't want to, we're so scared of sex being misunderstood. We're so scared of touch being misunderstood, of kindness to being misunderstood that we stopped having, being playful and flirting.

Rosie (11:31.823)

Yeah

Rosie (11:39.203)

Hmm... Hmm...

Rosie (11:45.122)

Yeah, yeah.

Mm. It's true.

I don't know the answer though, because there can be some icky things that happen. But hey, go out and flirt with somebody. That's y- Boundaries! Yes! Yes, boundaries.

Roula (12:02.729)

This is where we have to learn to put boundaries and say no. Yeah.

Roula (12:13.149)

If we learn how to put boundaries and to read the signs and say no when we're not comfortable, maybe flirting will come back in a new shape and different ways.

Rosie (12:21.371)

Hmm.

Rosie (12:25.574)

Roula you look radiant today.

Roula (12:31.071)

Thank you. That was my naked spa. Go and listen to our episode about the naked spa.

Rosie (12:33.062)

You

Rosie (12:39.429)

Let us know what you think about flirting.

Roula (12:42.761)

Thank you, bye.