85: Should You Call or Text When Having A Difficult Conversation?

Rosie (00:01)
So last episode, Ruler, we were talking about wearing Crocs to a wedding. We spoke so much, we're now on a new episode. And you, everybody go on YouTube, please. You need to see this outrageous. They're like clogs, but like a Bratz doll shoe and they're lined with like fake fur. Is it like lined with fur on the inside as well?

Roula (00:28)
It's full, yeah. These are bulldozers.

Rosie (00:30)
It's like

a... bulldozed us!

and you wear these in public.

Roula (00:38)
No, I only wear them in the garden and when I go to throw the trash. And one day a friend of my son saw me wearing them and she was like, these are very big shoes.

Rosie (00:42)
Why don't you wear them out?

So judgmental. Well, I dare you ruler to wear those to a special event.

Roula (00:57)
Yes.

I wouldn't, because my husband, when he saw me wearing them, he said, Yerula, you're not getting any for the next month, because these turn me off so much.

Rosie (01:06)
SLEEEET

They're as shallow as each other!

Next question from our super fan slash obsessed listener. Here we go.

Hello, Zia Marulla. I'm just wondering, do you prefer calling people or texting them?

I to text people, but I'm happy to call people if I know them. What are your thoughts?

Roula (01:50)
Rosie, you can start.

Rosie (01:51)
I was trying to

wait you out fine

just makes me think back to when I was a kid. Mum would make me make phone calls for her. So just dial the number and she said, just tell them that Tina wants to talk to them. And I'm like, why can't you do it? And I would get so anxious and I'd rehearse in my head what to say. But it helped me build more confidence because for whatever reason, I found that really daunting to call someone up and

not know where the conversation was going to go. That was terrifying to me. I still sometimes get anxiety around making phone calls.

Roula (02:37)
Difficult phone calls or whatever?

Rosie (02:39)
Oh, just a

whatever thing.

Like today, I had to call a solicitor, someone I'd never spoken to, to help me with an issue or a dispute I'm dealing with with a client. And I was really anxious to call. It was just a call to set up an appointment. Nothing, nothing crazy. I was really anxious, but I called up, did it, took 10 seconds and I was like, that wasn't so bad. So do I prefer calling or texting?

Hmm. Sometimes people call me and I go, I don't want to talk. Like, piss off. And I just won't answer.

Like if it's someone I know.

You're not talking and I'm feeling ve- I'm feeling really uncomfortable Rula, can you please talk?

Roula (03:22)
How many times has this to me?

I noticed in the past episodes I talk too much through you so now I'm trying to contain myself.

Rosie (03:32)
feel very awkward! It's just me going

blub blub blub. I need some feedback, please.

Roula (03:38)
What did you say last?

Rosie (03:40)
Don't know.

Roula (03:41)
I know either. ⁓ yeah, I was saying how many times it happened that you did not answer my calls. You're on camera now.

Rosie (03:43)
kinda been that good.

yeah, I didn't answer your last phone call, did I?

I didn't answer the last time you called me, did I? Do you remember?

Roula (03:56)
I warn you, I tell you, I have a long drive so I'm calling you.

Rosie (04:00)
You usually do, yeah. That time you didn't. That time you didn't. I was like, you sent me a voice message. What?

Roula (04:02)
Yeah. ⁓ thanks.

You would, ⁓ bad timing.

Rosie (04:14)
You know, last time you called, I

Roula (04:14)
RoC ⁓

going to double down on this one because I'm from a generation where there was no text. There was either the phone, you know the one that you turn or even more terrifying, you would go to their house.

Rosie (04:23)
Okay. Or nothing. Yeah. They were fun, yeah.

Roula (04:38)
and ring the bell to talk to them about something. Because not everyone had even a phone.

Rosie (04:46)
wow.

Roula (04:47)
Okay, fast forward for today. I tried to call people and times I know they won't be available to answer. So I say, I called you and then I text them.

No.

Rosie (05:05)
Is

that... Okay, why? Come on. What? It is. You did not make that up. No, no, no, no, no. No, no, no, no, no.

Roula (05:08)
No, that's not true. That's not true. The idea just crossed my mind. No, no, the idea just crossed

my mind. ⁓ shut up, Rosie. Let me finish.

Rosie (05:16)
You fu-

Roula (05:19)
This idea crossed my mind just now in my funny moments. The truth is I don't mind calling at all. Only at my convenience. So if you don't pick up and you call me back, I have no obligation to answer because I don't like speaking on the phone. It's such a waste of my time.

Rosie (05:21)
Mmm... Mmm...

Mmm.

You don't like speaking on the phone. I thought you just said you do.

Roula (05:44)
No, no, it's...

I don't. I don't have a problem calling for a difficult conversation, for a request, etc. But I just don't want to answer because it's not on my own time.

Rosie (05:50)
but you don't want to answer.

Yeah, actually, every time

I call you, you don't answer. I don't think you have answered once. Wow. Wow. So you prefer calling, but only on your terms. You're not going to answer the call because I don't have time for that.

Roula (06:00)
It's not in my own time. You should make an appointment to call me.

Look, with my friends we know already, we're very honest about it, and if we don't want to answer it's fine. We all don't feel like speaking on the phone. We don't. Maybe it's something with my generation. ⁓ And I avoid speaking on the phone with people that will not get into the topic and it's gonna take forever to hang up. Yes.

Rosie (06:18)
Yeah

Yeah.

They don't get to the point, yes.

Don't waste my time.

Roula (06:40)
This is also something. I worked at a job where we were forced to call rather than sending an email.

Rosie (06:54)
What?

Roula (06:56)
Yeah, in the realm of good communication, there was so much freaking passive-aggressive meetings because people did not have the chance to calm down, to send an email, to think about what they want to say. It wasn't a good environment forcing us to go and talk to the people in person. Also, are introvert people who prefer to take it slow and think about what they want to say, get ready.

Rosie (07:00)
⁓

Haha

Right!

That's a really good point.

Roula (07:26)
control their breath, their emotions or whatever. It's really personal preference. We must not judge.

We should know when we must talk over the phone and not in text, because also lot of misunderstanding would come in the text. Like, you know, remember the passive aggressive thumb up that you feel in a text? While when you're talking to that person, maybe they will be so joyful agreeing with you, you wouldn't notice.

Rosie (07:43)
Mmm.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah. ⁓

okay. So what's an example when you think texting is not appropriate and it needs to be a phone call?

Roula (08:01)
When you want to say to someone that you're upset with them or they did something wrong, a negative thing must be ⁓ treated in person, whether in a phone call or face to face.

Rosie (08:06)
Mmm.

So confronting!

Roula (08:18)
Cool.

Rosie (08:20)
Because I understand.

But I've also learned, because I used to have a similar point of view, but then I realized not everybody deals with conflict in the same way. And I've discovered a lot of people need time to process. So if you put it in writing and send it to them, they have time to think. And then in their own time, they get back to you so that if they want to have a tantrum and shout and swear, whatever, they can do that and then get back to you rather than, my God, there's this big fight.

Roula (08:54)
I disagree. The more we do this, the less we'll train ourselves to have healthy conflict and repair after the conflict.

Rosie (08:55)
HUUUU

Roula (09:06)
We must find like middle ground in this. Write it for yourself to get your emotions out. And then when you go to the conflict, learn how to control yourself.

Rosie (09:15)
The other person

hasn't had time to write it down because they don't know what you're upset about.

Roula (09:21)
But how you

bring it to them, you can bring it to them in a way. If they're going to be upset, no matter how you will bring it to them, it's on them to learn how to deal with their conflict.

Rosie (09:31)
Wow. Wow. I don't know how I feel about this.

So if you're to have an argument with somebody, call them. If you want to say, love you, do it via text.

Roula (09:47)
Not to call them when you're in the emotions.

And if you want to have an argument with somebody, don't ever text them telling them, I need to talk to you. Never. Yes.

Rosie (09:57)
Ooh, that's the worst feeling when you get a message like that.

my God. Yes. Yeah. Right. So you prefer calling or not? I don't understand why you like, you prefer calling if it's something bad or you don't mind calling if it's you calling. But if I'm calling, you don't like calls. You're just a contradiction.

Roula (10:20)
So much, so much.

Why you're throwing them all at me?

Why you're throwing them all at me, on me? Let the listener decide what they want to do, our different perspectives.

Rosie (10:35)
Yeah, I don't even know where I stand on it. I, sometimes I dread phone calls, but then when I'm talking to someone, like a friend, I'm like, yeah, I forgot how nice it is to talk on the phone. Cause it's just, it doesn't feel as personal or intimate via text, but you know what is a happy middle ground for me is voice messages. Like the voice recordings you can send each other. Like you and I will do that on WhatsApp. And that feels a bit more personal than a text message.

Roula (10:50)
True.

Mmm.

I love that it's more personal, it wastes much less time in typing and it wastes much less time in calling and after these voice messages if it's necessary to call then both know what's coming up.

Rosie (11:09)
Mm.

So if

I wanted to talk about something negative with you, would it have to be a phone call or is a voice message acceptable?

Roula (11:26)
Depends how are you bringing it to me.

this is the essence, this is the essence. We don't want to call, we want to text. Or we want to call, we don't want to text. It doesn't matter which method we choose, as long as we do it in a way that we're not overreacting, our emotions are not going crazy all over the place.

Rosie (11:45)
You are contradicting

yourself, young lady.

Roula (11:49)
And in time, and if you have

something good to tell, just pick up the phone or send the text. Do it the way you want.

Rosie (11:58)
Okay, so you've kind of backtracked on what you said. You're basically saying do what you want, doesn't matter.

Roula (12:02)
What the fu- Why

you always have to do this with me? Like you- You like to- No! You like to prove me- You like to prove me wrong!

Rosie (12:07)
You're bullshit. You're so full of shit.

You just walk into it. One minute you're going my way or the highway. You have to phone, but only on my terms. And now you're saying, it's okay. Do what you want.

Roula (12:22)
Yes, you can do what you want. Am I going to answer? Maybe not. Maybe it's not the right time for me. These are two different things. It's the caller and the receiver.

Rosie (12:33)
This

is true, I've learnt to become comfortable not answering phone calls. I used to answer everything because I thought it would be rude not to pick up. Now, I look at it and go, you know what? I don't feel like calling, talking, and I'm not gonna call back.

There you go.

Roula (12:50)
You build your relationships with a text or with a phone call, so you're free to decide what works best for you.

Rosie (12:57)
Right, there you go. Okay. Let us know what you reckon, phone calls or texts, or does it not matter?

Roula (13:01)
We confused our listener and don't

you dare call me out on my bullshit because I will put you down. Don't go.

Rosie (13:09)
You will! But we

all know you're full of shit.

Alright, bye! Bye bye bye! Shut up, bye.

Roula (13:15)
goodness, so rude. Bye!